Senator Collins Questions Deputy AG Rosenstein at Appropriations Hearing

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Washington, D.C. - At a U.S. Senate Appropriations Subcommittee hearing this morning, U.S. Senator Susan Collins, a senior member of the Appropriations Committee, questioned Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein.

A transcript of Senator Collins’ Q&A with Mr. Rosenstein follows:

COLLINS: Deputy Attorney General, Mr. Rosenstein, I just want to follow up quickly on the two questions that Senator Shaheen asked you about the special counsel. Has the president ever discussed with you the appointment of the special counsel or discussed the special counsel in any way?

ROSENSTEIN: No, he has not.

COLLINS: And second, if President Trump ordered you to fire the special counsel, what would you do?

ROSENSTEIN: Senator, I’m not going to follow any orders unless I believe those are lawful and appropriate orders. Under the regulation, Special Counsel Mueller may be fired only for good cause, and I’m required to put that cause in writing. And so that's what I would do. If there were good cause, I would consider it, if there were not good cause, it wouldn't matter to me what anybody says.

COLLINS: Thank you. I want to turn to the opioid crisis, which plagues my state and so many others. Last year drug overdoses were responsible for more than 59,000 deaths in this country, including a record 376 such deaths in Maine. That is 104 more overdose deaths than the year before in my state. So we are not making progress; the situation is actually getting worse despite considerable efforts on the part of so many. Last year, I was briefed in Maine by federal law enforcement officers who told me that they have seen a major influx of drug dealers coming from out of state with direct ties to gangs in major cities, as well as the Mexican drug cartels. For example, in one case, gang members trafficked heroin between New Haven, Connecticut and Bangor, Maine, where I live. They traded drugs for firearms and then distributed those firearms to other gang members upon their return to Connecticut. We obviously need a multi-pronged approach to the heroin and opioid crisis that includes treatment, education and prevention, and law enforcement. And key to that law enforcement leg of that stool is cooperation among federal, state, and local officials. The department’s budget requests $3 million less than Congress appropriated for the Comprehensive Addiction and Recovery Act programs for the current fiscal year, and even more troubling to me is there is no funding proposed for the COPS Anti-Heroin Task Force. In my state, this program has helped law enforcement officers seize heroin and prescription opioids and arrest drug dealers. Why is this administration proposing this cut in the CARA funding and eliminating the funding for the COPS Anti-Heroin Task Force?

ROSENSTEIN: Senator, I appreciate that question. I think there are a lot of important issues. For me this is actually one of the most important issues that I hope to talk about today. I don’t know if I can give a complete answer in a minute and 35 seconds, but let me tell you, I’ve actually brought with me a chart that I think might be of interest to you. This is a chart of drug overdose deaths in the United States of America. This issue first came to my attention as US attorney in Maryland about three or four years ago, when it was brought to my attention that there had been a significant spike in deaths attributable to opioid drugs in our state, and it has only accelerated since then. But these are frightening numbers, Senator. The final statistics from 2015 reflect about 52,000 Americans lost their lives to drug overdoses that year, and we believe that 2016 projections may be over 60,000. It will be some time before we have the final numbers. More than half—a substantial proportion—of those were attributable to opioid drugs.

When I first learned about this, we were talking about the heroin crisis, and people thought about heroin and oxycodone, which is a lawful prescription drug that often can be abused. Increasingly, the challenge we face is about fentanyl, which is an even more hazardous drug that poses a danger even to our first responders, police, firefighters, and paramedics, who are responding to scenes of overdoses because of how deadly and dangerous that drug can be.

This is a very significant challenge to us. There are a lot of issues, a lot of ways we can go about addressing it. One of which, you talked about, the gangs that bring drugs into your home state. I know from my experience as U.S. Attorney, that’s an area where our federal prosecutors and DEA agents do a lot of good. Law enforcement isn’t the only solution to the heroin and opioid crisis, but from our perspective, it’s one of the key tools the Department of Justice has to target these organizations and try to identify the sources of supply and put those drug dealers out of business. One of the most important things I think we’re going to do this year under this budget is that we are going to be able to fund about 900 additional employees for DEA. These are not new positions. My understanding from our budget experts is these are positions that are existing but, for the most part, were not filled because of budgetary constraints. So we anticipate we’ll have up to 900 more personnel on the front lines of DEA, we’ll have additional federal prosecutors, and that, from the Department’s perspective, will help us to combat that.

But, if I may continue, it’s not just about law enforcement. There are many other areas and many other ways that we can combat drug abuse. The Justice Department obviously focuses primarily on law enforcement, but we do have these grand programs that allows us to do other things. The COPS program, as you mentioned, is proposed to be eliminated in this budget, but we request $7 million funding that I think is not in this year’s budget, but we do request $40.4 million in additional federal funding for DEA prescription opioid and heroin enforcement programs. So this is a matter not of reducing our emphasis on that issue, but of reprioritizing the money to places we think it will be more effective.

This will allow DEA to expand funding for its 360 strategy, which is intended to illustrate that it’s not just about law enforcement, it’s a 360 degree program to try to reduce drug abuse. It will allow us to enhance operations against domestic cartels that are responsible for drug distribution, and to enhance and establish regulatory and enforcement groups in the diversion control program and increase funding for our prescription drug disposal programs, because often drugs that are legally prescribed and not used, they may be diverted to illegal uses. So through all those ways, Senator, I can commit to you that we are very much attuned; I will be watching those overdose numbers, and I will not be satisfied until I see that trend turn around and start going the other direction.